This is just incredible news and 2on2 is the way to go! Nice balance between individual skill and teamplay effort which easy to follow even if you are not a seasoned qw player. QW 1on1 is boring as hell to watch (and play). I think people mostly spec 1on1 for the drama anyways instead of it being that interesting gameplay-wise..

Many things to consider here. I understand where ID is coming from. Lots of people will be watching this, out of which about 99% will not be qw players and probably unfamiliar with the game completely. QW duel is objectively not a very pretty thing to broadcast, IMO, too much relies on spawnfragging. Those who play the game perceive it differently, of course, but IMO it will be just boring for spectators who don't understand the specifics. It will look like the player in control is overly lucky, it will look like the spawns on the maps are retarded (which they are) e.t.c. I think it'll show uglier sides which we who play it understand and came to terms with and accept as rules of the game, but it won't be transparent for others. Just imagine 50 000 people who have never seen QW watch 0:0 DM2 with someone camping ra/mega... or raping spawns at ztn, or holding LG on DM4.

2on2, on the other hand, will showcase everything that is good about QW - the action, the speed, beautiful frags. Yeah, it won't show 1on1 mindgames and tactics and 4on4 teamplay and decision-making, but these are not the things a lot of people who are unfamiliar with the game will be able to understand easily anyway.
And 4on4 would have been too hard to organize, indeed.

As someone who doesn't like 2on2 much I would also prefer to watch 4on4 or 1on1, but ID is seeing this from a different perspective and so will the viewers. I'd agree that 2on2 is the best way to go in this case.

I have to say i agree with Locktar.

And someone here says qw 2on2 today is teamplay?

Well yes it is teamplay because you have 1 team mate, but qw 2on2 today dont remind me much of teamplay. For one it is weaponstay. 2ndly you play the same maps as you do in duel. And 3rd the way 2on2 is being played today is really just attack attack attack; where is the tactics? Seems to me 2on2 today is a game of chance and aim, where the best duellers win if they team up. A good dueller can even win the game alone even with a sucky team mate. Where is the teamplay here really?

In a real teamplay battle, aka 4on4, things are different, we all know that.

I want to thank Quakecon for doing this, it is awesome

Having said that, Locktar is correct: after the tournament those 2on2 teams will vanish in thin air, only going there for the money. Also the 2on2 tournament will be very predictable and not very exciting, as the general qw scene has seen this all before and know the outcome.

However a duel tournament of this potential would wipe out the TG Invitational and make it ancient history, making the Quakecon tournament the best duel tournament ever in the history of FPS (no i am not kidding). The tournament itself will be very unpredictable with the best duellers on the planet. And we are not talking about only 5-6 players who can win it, we are talking 20 players who on a good day can win it all.

I understand why the 4on4 is hard to do.

GL to everyone its a great thing for QW no matter what!

(Edited 2016-02-25, 12:01)

LoL and 2on2 does not? Its 10 times worse on 2on2

No idea about LoL, never even watched it.
There's generally more going on in 2on2 than in duel - that's the point. Overall - yeah, many of the same arguments that apply to 1on1 apply to 2on2 as well, but exactly because 2on2 has 2 more people it will be more exciting for unrelated people to watch. IMO. You can at least switch views more often. And spawnraping two people is more pretty than spawnraping just one. Theoretically .

Well when it comes to 2on2 with todays modes, maps, speed and teamplay, i think 2on2 will be more confusing for a non-qw viewer than a duel. I think the non-qw viewer will understand the skills being displayed more in a duel than 2on2. The game is so fast now that even for the best players a 2on2 can be pretty chaothic at times.

Dm4 2on2 with equal teams: can you say "random shit happens often"
Dm2 2on2 with equal teams: can you say "hey i just got spawnraped 10 times coz i spawned water tele tele water quad-low tele water tele water quad-low"

I also noticed that you got 2on2 with Quad on Aero and Ztndm3. WTF is a Quad-LG doing in 2on2? Beats me.

One day I might make a video with commentary of one of my dm2 2on2s and explain the team play, tactics and decision-making involved. I think many would be surprised.


No offense, but the fact that 2on2 _seems_ like a game of chance and aim to you doesn't really mean a thing. It just shows that you are pretty clueless when it comes to the game mode. On the other hand 1on1 comes quite close to the game of chance and aim you described when a certain level is reached because the game play is much simpler than in game modes with more players.

Already looking forward to it The game needs such content from the best in it because there is just NO such content atm. A couple of ddk's videos, nothing more.

Also, I think I was a bit misunderstood here: I don't say that 2on2 has no tactics or decision-making, far from it. It's just that I think these things will be more visible to unrelated viewers in other game modes. Not that many of them will care about these things while watching anyway...

Still remember how a couple of years ago during Doom anniversary QuakeCon had Doom duel tournament. I got completely fascinated with the thing as a result. And I still remember how many people in chat were bored or didn't care or even complaining about having to watch it, even though IMO it was very captivating to watch...

I consider myself a duelist and personally find QuakeWorld duels way more fascinating than QuakeLive for example. QuakeLive to me is too item timing dependent, you basically need the superior stack to win a fight. You see the top players take the same route to the same items over and over depending on they got the superior stack or inferior stack. Where as the powerful LG and RL in QuakeWorld can make a surprise attack worth more than any stack, and awards creative play way more than in QuakeLive. And not to talk about what kind of play a weapon like RG promotes... The only thing I can think of that is better in QuakeLive duels is the constant shift of maps in the tournaments, and the quality of maps. I think rotating maps in QuakeWorld duel tournaments should be done a long time ago.

Of course I was hoping for a duel tournament myself, but seriously... This mode this, this mode that... I was planning on going no matter what, as long as there was a QW tournament. It could be a DM2 only tournament with registration fee and no price money, and I would still go.

Each mode got their own perks. For me, the psychological tensions and mind games that arise in duels far surpasses the joy I get from any other game modes. There's too many variables in any of the game modes to make even the best of us close to perfection. To say that one mode takes more or less skills than another mode sounds like ignorance to me.

Obviously. at the end of the day I'm just really fucking happy QuakeCon is hosting something like this at all.

edit: Originally written on the run, and some sentences didn't make sense at all.

(Edited 2016-02-26, 04:58)

Well Milton i understand the tactics and the game mode. But a tactic that promotes being aggressive over defensive is not necessarily the best way to play, its just that QWers like that the most and hence has built the tactics around that.

Do this please, would be helpful.

-- not the place to talk about this --

(Edited 2016-02-25, 16:15)

Oh snap! I'm thinking about it, would have to figure out a way to come straight from my (1 year postponed) honeymoon. And I can see the argument for 1on1 and there should probably be at least a semi-official 1on1 tournament on the side, but 2on2 is awesome and doesn't get enough respect from the duelers and 4on4'ers.

Love,
BD

i will be happy to watch any qw at quakecon, but if milton/rikoll/locktar etc are in the same building (or even continent) as gt etc and they dont get to duel, i will be devastated!

lets drink some beers!!!

If I'm there then sure, but I'm not sure if Europeans can keep up with Canadians

Also forgot to mention that at least when I 2on2 with voice, there's a ton of communication related to a combination of strategy, item timing, enemy status, quad, etc. and it might be interesting to cast pieces of that during matches. +1 vote for Andeh, great caster and great knowledge of qw

Useless side anecdote: I attended QuakeCon 2011 pretty much by mistake. I was in Dallas in the summer working on a 3-month project, and I was playing QW at nights on my crappy laptop on the crappy hotel wi-fi with the (then active) U.S. scene. I was driving on the highway one day and saw a huge sign for QuakeCon and thought I was hallucinating... Ended up spending the day there, didn't coordinate with or see anyone playing QW so I just played all day with the usual people online

I sent an email to Ms. Lilie and she promptly answered me and made a few things clear. I will be in Dallas in a week and she said I could stop by to talk about some of our ideas and so on.

How about we make a conference call with active community members?

I would love to see guys like Ocoini, andeh, dimman, Milton, locktar, hooraytio and many others that drives the scene brainstorming about things we could during the event days.

Well, if not here, then where?

Hello gang! I'm here along with Lillie to help facilitate communication between your community and the event, although Lillie is pretty on-point with her responses! We're so excited about QuakeCon 2016 and can't wait to see most of you there!

cwizard - director community

Not sure what surprised me the most. A serious tournament for QW or the fact that they chose 2on2 as the mode.

I guess a duel tournament would've made more sense, more players (from EU) would probably have tried to give it a shot.

But then again I've always considered the team aspect of QW to be what really made it so much fun and addictive so in that sense I'm quite satisfied with it being 2on2.

Though from a spectator point of view, a duel tournament would probably have attracted more players and made it more competitive

This. Those who go should really use the opportunity and organize something aside. If no other tournament receives official QuakeCon character, I'm sure something could be set up on the Quakeworld.nu tournament template sites. I mean, what else would you do for the rest of the time? Watch others player boring games?

Im going even if i dont have a 2on2 teammate, just to be rikolls groupie.

Of course, I hope my finnish internet-best-friend-forever Badass will tag along.

+1 on Milton explaining what he thinks while he is playing 2on2. How about as soon as possible? the amont of hours i work these days only allow for a quick dl of all milton demos before bedtime. Might be why i got single again. Like, how does he know for sure that the damn megahealth will be there everytime he safes the difficult side big to mega jump?

Please elaborate.

For those considering not going, if you havent met Locktar, it will be worth it just for that.

Furthermore; be adviced all players considering taking down Milton and Rikoll. Its perfectly doable. Their big egos will collide.

Hell, if Bps and Cara were to sign up, they would probably be the favourites. Dear i mention a murzik+meshuggah team? Maybe even nitram+lacsap?

Hlt, with his quad rocket jumps on dm2 while aggressively spamming down poor Dmt with team messages are also worth noting.

I realized after posting that my thoughts and ideas were better in private

On topic:

I talked to Lilie, and for anyone wondering why 2on2;
QuakeCon will be running a 1on1 tournament for QuakeLive, and wanted a different format in QuakeWorld. They however realized that bringing entire teams to Texas for a 4on4 tournament is hard, and thus they ended up on 2on2. This has been decided and cannot be changed, so prepare for some 2on2 boys n girls!

I'm saddened by the fact that Milton+Rikoll will play together, since they're more than super likely to take first place. However, QuakeCon were prepared for such an occassion and therefore decided to give prize money to the top 8 teams, so chances to get some money is quite high for any good team.

I really hope this tournament becomes a blast even though it's 2on2. I know that people from other games will have a very hard time understanding anything (imagine watching a game on Twitch where someone dies over and over again for no particular reason). Of course us players know that there is more to it than just dying, but it will definitely not be good for spectators.

So boys, spread the word! Perhaps some old faces will find this interesting as well (hey Martin!)

+1

Would be awesome to be able to participate. Things are uncertain for me though since a lot of money will be spent on a wedding this summer

C'mon stock prizes, rise god damnit, riiiiise!!

Either how I do hope that whoever wins *cough* will donate some amount to some qw projects

There is no point everyone petitioning Quakecon for a 1on1. It is nice they are doing something. However im sure the select few who have made contact could display the credentials & hunger for it, dualmania worldwide, previous seasons + thunderdome etc.

As far as 2on2 goes, tbh, it may aswell be 3on3 or ffa. Can take it or leave it and it may be miserable but if I missed it I wouldnt even bother with demos. It is fun to play, to a point, but not to watch at all.

...well suddenly today there were a lot of fakenickers doing 2on2 with 13 ms ping on swe servers...pretty much pwning everyone. We might be in for more players who can win this now. I mean if players like dag, pietro, gamer, scenic, goljat, paradoks, hib, mazer, mrlame, griffin etc etc wants some money they got 5 months to prac.

whoever was making the argument that 1on1 mode makes spawns look bad I can't wait to see the look on their faces with the maplock on 6.

e: and 2 / ztndm3 lol

Could somebody contact some of the big names from the past? I think that maybe paradoks and a few others may feel motivated enough to practice and play decently.