Are we to assume these players actually know this new map? (except Milton, he knows all)
Not trying to be negative, just realistic.

I don't remember when we started playing cmt maps. Was it EQL 5 or 6 ? Several years ago this. I would say everyone knows the layout and has a general idea of what is good to do.

Schloss is fairly new, in quake standards - I don't know. I would say more than three people on each team know of and have played this map several times. I can't say this is true 100% - but i believe: bps, cara, xantom, blooddog, nigve, milton, rikoll, creature have all played both schloss and the cmt maps in question several times.

Theres knowing the layout of the map, and then there is knowing the map to the point where it's been "established what is best to do" and having things internalised to the point where you don't have to think to much on tactics..
I would think it varies from person to person on how good each player is on the maps when it comes to schloss and cmt.

An1 - hardly anyone if any knows the map - which is some of the point of playing it as well. It will be fun to see them adapt, and perhaps some humorous moments will be viewed =) I think it will be a refreshing map when we get to it =)
Annihilator has made a video of the map, detailing very thoroughly a rundown of the maps interesting points.

Regardless, we were not playing tb3x2, and the captains "voted" for the maps, and we had a little discussion on which ones to pick.

The cmt maps we picked - in retrospect - are likely the easiest maps to learn for anyone playing quake.
They have also had some time now where they knew very well of the intent of including an1 - and also that schloss and cmt4/3 maps they have known and been apart of deciding for two weeksish now.

It's the teams that make the final decision on which map we play - It's not out of the question that we modify the pool slightly should a strong argument be made for it - but I'm super happy with the pool we ended on at least.

There arn't many players that have more potential to learn and understand "new maps" than the ones that are nominated to play in the all stars - so even if someone doesn't know one of the maps very well - they would anyway have the best background to understand how a new maps "should" be played - much better than the majority of us.

Hope i answered your question (and other people's question at the same time about the other maps)

Guess we'll find out if anyone has to download the map from the server, haha.
Personally I would find watching a map where only 1 or 2 know the layout kinda dull but that's just me.

P.S. It's nice to see Anza and Pani getting the Star tag, it's well overdue!

Nice with an all-star game again! But I see...dead people, no, but I DONT see how some of these players were picked for this before grc. Horrible i.m.o.

Really cool how I have to watch with people talking 24/7 and I can't change pov. Nice. What's the fucking password. Qizmo cams was better.

Facepalm:
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- VVD - #qw.ru : QTV Error: Authentication failure - WTF?!?!?!
<[ServeMe]01> -spam- gore - qw://london.badplace.eu:28504 ru 2/4 : they fucked all qtv for w/e reason, use the stream
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- (spec) bgnr - qw://nl2.badplace.eu:28501 fr 2/2 : organizers disabled qtv, its available via tastyspleentv twitch stream
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- gore - qw://london.badplace.eu:28504 ru 2/4 : disabled? people are still on it, just lol really
<[ServeMe]10> -qw- VVD - #thunderdome : stream is laggy as hell and with ugly hud, just keep qtv open, mazafakers!!!
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- (spec) bgnr - qw://nl2.badplace.eu:28501 fr 2/2 : i understand their motives, its fair for the streamer to have audience, i cant watch it too,,,btw vvd see mymail
<[ServeMe]01> -spam- gore - qw://london.badplace.eu:28504 ru 2/4 : what's wrong with having a choice of qtv or stream? lol
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- VVD - #-1 : motivation to denied to spec via qw client 20-30 qw players? lol! Yes, I read, go IRC.
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- (spec) bgnr - qw://nl2.badplace.eu:28501 fr 2/2 : im out of the real motives, but i belive is to incentive the streamer, streamers get money also recognition by having users, and if they help us, its a fair deal
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- gore - qw://london.badplace.eu:28504 ru 2/4 : can watch it on badplace.eu, phew
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- bgnr - qw://london.badplace.eu:28502 ru 1/4 : professor
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- VVD - #qwrookie : Thanks to organisators of 4on4 All Stars for impossible to look games online! You know what to do with self!
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- gore - qw://london.badplace.eu:28504 ru 3/4 : not impossible, just annoying to not be able to hear in game sounds
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- multibear - qw://qw.servegame.org:27500 de 7/25 : video freeze evey 2 minutes
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- gore - qw://london.badplace.eu:28504 ru 3/4 : yeah they don't really care about people with substandard internet
<[ServeMe]01> -qw- multibear - qw://qw.servegame.org:27500 de 8/25 : stream quality is too high and i can't change it

Very basic demo list available here: https://badplace.eu/tournament/allstars-autumn2018, will do a proper tournament page with previous all-star games at some point.

Really good event, thanks to everyone organising/commentating/playing.

I see a lot of complaining, but it was a good event. Maybe don't take an exhibition event as seriously as EQL grand finals. If you can't give a new map a shot for 20 minutes during a 7-map long exhibition, then when can you play it?

Thanks to everyone who set it up and participated. I really enjoyed it.

Was a good show and I enjoyed it, thanks for organising Ocoini!

With regards to QTV/Twitch a better approach might be to just encourage people to use Twitch without blocking QTV. I had a hard time with buffering from time to time so having the option would be nice, could've still kept a muted buffering stream running in the background to support the viewer numbers.

Also don't mind new maps but think there should be better candidates out there to be honest.

> I enjoyed it
…

(It's totally OK voicing frustration about aspects of the event, without us thinking you didn't like the event as a whole!).
Feedback is good, we don't take it personal!

My "brutally honest" reply:

You are not alone with not liking QTV being blocked. I understand the frustration (even without considering the inability to watch a stream). I know it's not popular - I am however not convinced by many of the arguments:
"This isn't what we are used to" arguments.
"only 30 people that want to watch qtv - what does it really matter?" or "most will likly qtv+stream combo".
I want to maximize viewers whatever way possible.

I tried to (and don't remember if we did it) for #1 and #2 AllStars to block QTV.
I wrote it in the news post that we were doing it as-well. I've been super clear about wanting and intending to do it.

I tried to be very welcoming to everyone that wants to contribute - and from forum post where allstar 2018 was announced:

"The QuakeWorld AllStars Showmatch is property of everyone that plays Quake – and anyone that wants to contribute, be it graphics, writing, technical finesses, opinions or ideas are more than welcome!"

As such the option of people to get involved was there, to poke me and scream and shout, you would likely very quickly have gotten an invite to whatever planning channel existed

I don't, contrary to "popular belief" , have unlimited time to cover all the bases.
Nor am i sure that the bases I want to cover, are followed up exactly how I want them, cus we are people not machines.
Nor do i have the computer know-how to even be aware of all my options. I might also just not think about something that others find totally obvious.

I set off with a set of goals, and i work to complete those goals.
If something isn't added in that list of goals I don't bring it up - and if Im not lucky enough that another person can fix a goal for us - then I have to abandon the goal.

Catering to the "QTV guys" wasn't on my list - because the thought of some people can't watch Twitch did not enter my mind.

The goal was and is maximizing stream viewers. To achieve that goal blocking qtv was apart of the aim.
My argument for blocking qtv i feel very strongly about. Because the AllStars isn't exactly for us, it's for that one guy bored looking for a game to play. That it has a lot of other benefits and fun for us is just a bonus. We want that one guy randomly installing QW =)

I have as well previously not been able to view streams because of connection, so it's not a matter of not understanding.
But I did not think about it this time.
If someone mentioned it, (which I can't say didn't happen, because I don't remember) i forgot about it.

I know very well that blocking qtv is not popular. I don't mind that -

However I regret that some of you were not able to have a good viewing pleasure live because of internet connection. (Even if you are not that "one random guy" i wanna see playing qw =)

I think if we do this again - and I am doing it (which is not required, you guys can do it too!) .Do remind me about this solution:

Offer a signup list for QTV viewers.

And if/when I hesitate to your reminder, because I don't remember offering the solution - give the argument that you are unable to watch streaming service because of lagg - that should make me feel bad enough to change my mind=) Not pity - but "OH, i didn't think about that, thanks!" <3

Easiest solution is of course to get involved running the next one, I would much rather prefer having a more limited role! =)

There are ALOT of things we could do to improve the AllStars - But we need more people involved. Like a live draft, graphics, more content, predictions, more help with reach out to gaming sites... lots lots more people can do that I can't - because i'm computer illiterate and don't have unlimited time.
Meag as well, that helped quite alot for this one - we all have limited time... the door was never closed or locked for others to pitch in(many did, but again time..) ! =)

There is a certain totalitarian feeling to forcing players to watch through twitch. With a community like QuakeWorld´s, where everyone is doing everything for free while also enjoying the product for free, I guess people get accustomed to the freedom under responsibility. This doesn´t mix very well with the concept of forcing people to enjoy the game a certain way. I believe this is the source of most of the critique.

The solution to this should be to have a QTV-code that you can hand out to people who simply ask you on the forum or on discord. This way more people watch on twitch, supporting both Jehar and the community as a whole, while not limiting people´s freedom. Most people won´t be bothered to message you if they know they can simply watch on twitch. Some people who really want to watch in the client could just go through the minimal trouble of asking for the password.